So...what did Paul actually play on?

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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Heston » 19 Oct 2017, 11:16am

punkmocker wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 9:34am
On `The Clash` i read somewhere that Paul played all the bass apart from the middle eight of White Riot. A musician friend of mine reckons Paul would not have had the chops to play on quite a lot of `Rope`.
I disagree. He seems fine on the live versions. I also keep repeating this point, but it was well documented he was banished upstairs in Rehearsals until he learned all the GEER songs. That would have been a waste of time if Mick was playing everything.
So what does Marconi playing the mamba mean? "Marconi" is referring to the radio itself. It plays a deadly snake. The snake - the mamba - is slithering from the speakers. Ready to kill greedy corporations. Ready to free the world of all that is evil, and to leave behind only the youthful idealism encompassed by the tenets of rock and roll.

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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Kory » 19 Oct 2017, 2:13pm

Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 7:40am
Flex wrote:
18 Oct 2017, 12:39pm
Marky Dread wrote:
18 Oct 2017, 12:36pm
Those early Polydor demos tell it like it is for me.
I'd love a "live in studio" recording circa '81.
So you can listen to the arguments about the level of the bass on "Know Your Rights"? "Rat Patrol from Fort Bragg" is that document surely.
If we had a version that didn't sound like it was recorded in cardboard box, sure.
Inder:
Absolutely. Here's another collection of words:

Table salt (spoon hinge)
Octopus (Ukraine)
St. Petersburg (arms)
Ginger beer (cauliflower)
Pat Sajak (PSak)
Lamp post (self evident)
Florida Timeshare (ditto)
Heraclitus (EMI)
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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Kory » 19 Oct 2017, 2:18pm

Heston wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 11:16am
punkmocker wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 9:34am
On `The Clash` i read somewhere that Paul played all the bass apart from the middle eight of White Riot. A musician friend of mine reckons Paul would not have had the chops to play on quite a lot of `Rope`.
I disagree. He seems fine on the live versions. I also keep repeating this point, but it was well documented he was banished upstairs in Rehearsals until he learned all the GEER songs. That would have been a waste of time if Mick was playing everything.
What are we considering a middle eight in this song? The most complex part is that ascending/descending thing in the verse...I don't think I'd even say this song has a middle eight.
Inder:
Absolutely. Here's another collection of words:

Table salt (spoon hinge)
Octopus (Ukraine)
St. Petersburg (arms)
Ginger beer (cauliflower)
Pat Sajak (PSak)
Lamp post (self evident)
Florida Timeshare (ditto)
Heraclitus (EMI)
Developers (Developers Developers)
Boogie With Your Children

Marky Dread
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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Marky Dread » 19 Oct 2017, 2:18pm

Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:13pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 7:40am
Flex wrote:
18 Oct 2017, 12:39pm
Marky Dread wrote:
18 Oct 2017, 12:36pm
Those early Polydor demos tell it like it is for me.
I'd love a "live in studio" recording circa '81.
So you can listen to the arguments about the level of the bass on "Know Your Rights"? "Rat Patrol from Fort Bragg" is that document surely.
If we had a version that didn't sound like it was recorded in cardboard box, sure.
Rat Patrol sounds pretty decent mate it might not be the pro release we would all love but it's certainly plenty listenable. You can hear the bass fine on there. Only the alt. version of KYR is poor sounding and even that is listenable for a boot.
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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Marky Dread » 19 Oct 2017, 2:19pm

Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:18pm
Heston wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 11:16am
punkmocker wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 9:34am
On `The Clash` i read somewhere that Paul played all the bass apart from the middle eight of White Riot. A musician friend of mine reckons Paul would not have had the chops to play on quite a lot of `Rope`.
I disagree. He seems fine on the live versions. I also keep repeating this point, but it was well documented he was banished upstairs in Rehearsals until he learned all the GEER songs. That would have been a waste of time if Mick was playing everything.
What are we considering a middle eight in this song? The most complex part is that ascending/descending thing in the verse...I don't think I'd even say this song has a middle eight.
It just has eight middles.
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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Kory » 19 Oct 2017, 2:24pm

Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:18pm
Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:13pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 7:40am
Flex wrote:
18 Oct 2017, 12:39pm
Marky Dread wrote:
18 Oct 2017, 12:36pm
Those early Polydor demos tell it like it is for me.
I'd love a "live in studio" recording circa '81.
So you can listen to the arguments about the level of the bass on "Know Your Rights"? "Rat Patrol from Fort Bragg" is that document surely.
If we had a version that didn't sound like it was recorded in cardboard box, sure.
Rat Patrol sounds pretty decent mate it might not be the pro release we would all love but it's certainly plenty listenable. You can hear the bass fine on there. Only the alt. version of KYR is poor sounding and even that is listenable for a boot.
You must have a different version from me. My copies of KYR, RAD, CJ, AT, IC, and DIAS all sound like they were recorded inside a sock. Compared to the much clearer files for STH, RTC, etc, it's a pretty jarring listen.
Inder:
Absolutely. Here's another collection of words:

Table salt (spoon hinge)
Octopus (Ukraine)
St. Petersburg (arms)
Ginger beer (cauliflower)
Pat Sajak (PSak)
Lamp post (self evident)
Florida Timeshare (ditto)
Heraclitus (EMI)
Developers (Developers Developers)
Boogie With Your Children

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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Marky Dread » 19 Oct 2017, 2:31pm

Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:24pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:18pm
Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:13pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 7:40am
Flex wrote:
18 Oct 2017, 12:39pm


I'd love a "live in studio" recording circa '81.
So you can listen to the arguments about the level of the bass on "Know Your Rights"? "Rat Patrol from Fort Bragg" is that document surely.
If we had a version that didn't sound like it was recorded in cardboard box, sure.
Rat Patrol sounds pretty decent mate it might not be the pro release we would all love but it's certainly plenty listenable. You can hear the bass fine on there. Only the alt. version of KYR is poor sounding and even that is listenable for a boot.
You must have a different version from me. My copies of KYR, RAD, CJ, AT, IC, and DIAS all sound like they were recorded inside a sock. Compared to the much clearer files for STH, RTC, etc, it's a pretty jarring listen.
Well the version I remixed and shared here I think is pretty decent sounding. However I am also fortunate to have a copy of Mick's tape which I do not have permission to share. I always respect those kind of wishes. I also share when and wherever I can. I do not like holding stuff back but sometimes my hands are tied. I also have copy of Joe's Crummy Bum Blues that I'm unable to share.
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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Kory » 19 Oct 2017, 2:45pm

Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:31pm
Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:24pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:18pm
Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:13pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 7:40am


So you can listen to the arguments about the level of the bass on "Know Your Rights"? "Rat Patrol from Fort Bragg" is that document surely.
If we had a version that didn't sound like it was recorded in cardboard box, sure.
Rat Patrol sounds pretty decent mate it might not be the pro release we would all love but it's certainly plenty listenable. You can hear the bass fine on there. Only the alt. version of KYR is poor sounding and even that is listenable for a boot.
You must have a different version from me. My copies of KYR, RAD, CJ, AT, IC, and DIAS all sound like they were recorded inside a sock. Compared to the much clearer files for STH, RTC, etc, it's a pretty jarring listen.
Well the version I remixed and shared here I think is pretty decent sounding. However I am also fortunate to have a copy of Mick's tape which I do not have permission to share. I always respect those kind of wishes. I also share when and wherever I can. I do not like holding stuff back but sometimes my hands are tied. I also have copy of Joe's Crummy Bum Blues that I'm unable to share.
It does sound better than previous available copies for sure, but it's pretty impossible to polish a 9th generation tape or whatever those things come from. What's confusing to me is why some of those songs obviously come from a much cleaner generation while others are dirty and muffled as hell. It seems whoever had those earlier gens would also have earlier gens of all the songs.
Inder:
Absolutely. Here's another collection of words:

Table salt (spoon hinge)
Octopus (Ukraine)
St. Petersburg (arms)
Ginger beer (cauliflower)
Pat Sajak (PSak)
Lamp post (self evident)
Florida Timeshare (ditto)
Heraclitus (EMI)
Developers (Developers Developers)
Boogie With Your Children

Marky Dread
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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Marky Dread » 19 Oct 2017, 3:02pm

Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:45pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:31pm
Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:24pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:18pm
Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:13pm


If we had a version that didn't sound like it was recorded in cardboard box, sure.
Rat Patrol sounds pretty decent mate it might not be the pro release we would all love but it's certainly plenty listenable. You can hear the bass fine on there. Only the alt. version of KYR is poor sounding and even that is listenable for a boot.
You must have a different version from me. My copies of KYR, RAD, CJ, AT, IC, and DIAS all sound like they were recorded inside a sock. Compared to the much clearer files for STH, RTC, etc, it's a pretty jarring listen.
Well the version I remixed and shared here I think is pretty decent sounding. However I am also fortunate to have a copy of Mick's tape which I do not have permission to share. I always respect those kind of wishes. I also share when and wherever I can. I do not like holding stuff back but sometimes my hands are tied. I also have copy of Joe's Crummy Bum Blues that I'm unable to share.
It does sound better than previous available copies for sure, but it's pretty impossible to polish a 9th generation tape or whatever those things come from. What's confusing to me is why some of those songs obviously come from a much cleaner generation while others are dirty and muffled as hell. It seems whoever had those earlier gens would also have earlier gens of all the songs.
The whole story about the tape being found in a drawer etc is an odd one for sure. I think it's obvious the bootleg is from two separate sources. Mick's tape is way better sounding but does (did) have some defects on it. It's salvagable but probably not for an official release. Overpowered By Funk is a different mix/version to the common boot. I think the reason it has never had and probably won't get an official releas is twofold Joe is no longer here to give his blessing and the fact it caused so much consternation first time 'round. Personally I would love to see it get an official release because I feel it vindicates Mick's mix as being the better version if not the more marketable.
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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by matedog » 19 Oct 2017, 3:07pm

Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 3:02pm
Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:45pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:31pm
Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:24pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:18pm


Rat Patrol sounds pretty decent mate it might not be the pro release we would all love but it's certainly plenty listenable. You can hear the bass fine on there. Only the alt. version of KYR is poor sounding and even that is listenable for a boot.
You must have a different version from me. My copies of KYR, RAD, CJ, AT, IC, and DIAS all sound like they were recorded inside a sock. Compared to the much clearer files for STH, RTC, etc, it's a pretty jarring listen.
Well the version I remixed and shared here I think is pretty decent sounding. However I am also fortunate to have a copy of Mick's tape which I do not have permission to share. I always respect those kind of wishes. I also share when and wherever I can. I do not like holding stuff back but sometimes my hands are tied. I also have copy of Joe's Crummy Bum Blues that I'm unable to share.
It does sound better than previous available copies for sure, but it's pretty impossible to polish a 9th generation tape or whatever those things come from. What's confusing to me is why some of those songs obviously come from a much cleaner generation while others are dirty and muffled as hell. It seems whoever had those earlier gens would also have earlier gens of all the songs.
The whole story about the tape being found in a drawer etc is an odd one for sure. I think it's obvious the bootleg is from two separate sources. Mick's tape is way better sounding but does (did) have some defects on it. It's salvagable but probably not for an official release. Overpowered By Funk is a different mix/version to the common boot. I think the reason it has never had and probably won't get an official releas is twofold Joe is no longer here to give his blessing and the fact it caused so much consternation first time 'round. Personally I would love to see it get an official release because I feel it vindicates Mick's mix as being the better version if not the more marketable.
Didn't Teddy say Lucinda is Joe's voice and she generally defers to Mick/Paul? Seems like a release is possible, but Mick might worry that it would come across as him trying to vindicate himself now that Joe's not around (I don't see it that way, but I could see being worried of being perceived that way). Then again, we got the two unreleased songs on Sound System, so that's one less enticing thing to garner something release-worthy.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Marky Dread » 19 Oct 2017, 3:19pm

matedog wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 3:07pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 3:02pm
Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:45pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:31pm
Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:24pm


You must have a different version from me. My copies of KYR, RAD, CJ, AT, IC, and DIAS all sound like they were recorded inside a sock. Compared to the much clearer files for STH, RTC, etc, it's a pretty jarring listen.
Well the version I remixed and shared here I think is pretty decent sounding. However I am also fortunate to have a copy of Mick's tape which I do not have permission to share. I always respect those kind of wishes. I also share when and wherever I can. I do not like holding stuff back but sometimes my hands are tied. I also have copy of Joe's Crummy Bum Blues that I'm unable to share.
It does sound better than previous available copies for sure, but it's pretty impossible to polish a 9th generation tape or whatever those things come from. What's confusing to me is why some of those songs obviously come from a much cleaner generation while others are dirty and muffled as hell. It seems whoever had those earlier gens would also have earlier gens of all the songs.
The whole story about the tape being found in a drawer etc is an odd one for sure. I think it's obvious the bootleg is from two separate sources. Mick's tape is way better sounding but does (did) have some defects on it. It's salvagable but probably not for an official release. Overpowered By Funk is a different mix/version to the common boot. I think the reason it has never had and probably won't get an official releas is twofold Joe is no longer here to give his blessing and the fact it caused so much consternation first time 'round. Personally I would love to see it get an official release because I feel it vindicates Mick's mix as being the better version if not the more marketable.
Didn't Teddy say Lucinda is Joe's voice and she generally defers to Mick/Paul? Seems like a release is possible, but Mick might worry that it would come across as him trying to vindicate himself now that Joe's not around (I don't see it that way, but I could see being worried of being perceived that way). Then again, we got the two unreleased songs on Sound System, so that's one less enticing thing to garner something release-worthy.
Well that just makes common sense for Lucinda to defer to Mick and Paul. Mick has always struck me as someone who is an extremely generous person. I don't know who a release of RPfFB would harm now. Maybe Mick just feels subject covered.
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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by matedog » 19 Oct 2017, 3:36pm

Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 3:19pm
matedog wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 3:07pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 3:02pm
Kory wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:45pm
Marky Dread wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 2:31pm


Well the version I remixed and shared here I think is pretty decent sounding. However I am also fortunate to have a copy of Mick's tape which I do not have permission to share. I always respect those kind of wishes. I also share when and wherever I can. I do not like holding stuff back but sometimes my hands are tied. I also have copy of Joe's Crummy Bum Blues that I'm unable to share.
It does sound better than previous available copies for sure, but it's pretty impossible to polish a 9th generation tape or whatever those things come from. What's confusing to me is why some of those songs obviously come from a much cleaner generation while others are dirty and muffled as hell. It seems whoever had those earlier gens would also have earlier gens of all the songs.
The whole story about the tape being found in a drawer etc is an odd one for sure. I think it's obvious the bootleg is from two separate sources. Mick's tape is way better sounding but does (did) have some defects on it. It's salvagable but probably not for an official release. Overpowered By Funk is a different mix/version to the common boot. I think the reason it has never had and probably won't get an official releas is twofold Joe is no longer here to give his blessing and the fact it caused so much consternation first time 'round. Personally I would love to see it get an official release because I feel it vindicates Mick's mix as being the better version if not the more marketable.
Didn't Teddy say Lucinda is Joe's voice and she generally defers to Mick/Paul? Seems like a release is possible, but Mick might worry that it would come across as him trying to vindicate himself now that Joe's not around (I don't see it that way, but I could see being worried of being perceived that way). Then again, we got the two unreleased songs on Sound System, so that's one less enticing thing to garner something release-worthy.
Well that just makes common sense for Lucinda to defer to Mick and Paul. Mick has always struck me as someone who is an extremely generous person. I don't know who a release of RPfFB would harm now. Maybe Mick just feels subject covered.
Yeah, not faulting her for deferring to them at all, just that I think most decisions will be made by Mick and Paul, essentially. So you'll have to consider what their concerns, etc. will be.
Look, you have to establish context for these things. And I maintain that unless you appreciate the Fall of Constantinople, the Great Fire of London, and Mickey Mantle's fatalist alcoholism, live Freddy makes no sense. If you want to half-ass it, fine, go call Simon Schama to do the appendix.

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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Marky Dread » 19 Oct 2017, 3:58pm

Baker played bass on the first album. Then Johnny Green on GEER/LC/S! then Kosmo on CR.
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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by BasingSt78 » 19 Oct 2017, 4:17pm

Just a correction on S!. Bootsy Collins and JG split the tracks, while PS was filming a minor part in a film nobody gave a shit about then or now...
Last edited by BasingSt78 on 19 Oct 2017, 4:21pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: So...what did Paul actually play on?

Post by Marky Dread » 19 Oct 2017, 4:21pm

BasingSt78 wrote:
19 Oct 2017, 4:17pm
Just a correction on Rope. Bootsy Collins and JG split the tracks, while PS was filming a minor part in a film nobody gave a shit about then or now...
That film wasn't great but it does leave a fabulous stain on the memory.
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