Rat Patrol reconstruction
- TeddyB Not Logged In
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Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
For the record, my copy didn’t come from MJ but from a friend of us both, who he had it run off for back in ‘82. So he’s got plausible deniability! Also, it’s not sequenced, though again the four “final” (not final) acetates are sequenced as above.
- Marky Dread
- Messiah of the Milk Bar
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Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
I would much prefer a single on each of the four sides along with a stronger album track then the weaker ones scattered in between . But either way I still wish this had come out instead of CR. Now of course it should be both as a double disc.Inder wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:42pmI don't think it's actually a song, just some doodling.Chuck Mangione wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:35pmI'm gonna assume no WET because it was more of a RPFFB outtake than a CR outtake. I answered my own question there but better that than a lingering awkwardness.
Three killer tracks to open would've been interesting.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:33pmWhatever the debate, this is the running order Mick had cut to acetates at Electric Lady for RPFFB. There is also a photo of the four sided sequence from Electric Lady that was posted here sometime back, maybe by C.K.
SIDE 1
Straight to Hell
Know Your Rights
Rock the Casbah
Red Angel Dragnet
SIDE 2
Should I Stay or Should I Go?
Ghetto Defendant
Sean Flynn
SIDE 3
Car Jamming
The Fulham Connection II
Atom Tan
First Night Back in London
SIDE 4
Inoculated City
Death is a Star
Cool Confusion
Idle in Kangaroo Court W1
Death is a Star is rightfully buried towards the end, the SIS flip washes away the weirdness of RAD, B-material like First Night and CC is hidden between good tracks like 'City/Idle/Connection and Car Jamming. It just might work!
That way you get a marketable record for the label a compromise of the band/Glyn Johns and the original genius of Micks intention
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
"Without the common people you're nothing"
Nos Sumus Una Familia
- Marky Dread
- Messiah of the Milk Bar
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Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
Sorry if I mislead anyone here. I wrongly assumed it came direct from MJ.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:57pmFor the record, my copy didn’t come from MJ but from a friend of us both, who he had it run off for back in ‘82. So he’s got plausible deniability! Also, it’s not sequenced, though again the four “final” (not final) acetates are sequenced as above.
It's such a fascinating document. I love how it shows Micks vision of that time. Although the band chose the Glyn Johns route to cut down the length for a more commercial record. Micks RPfFB is a very commercial sounding record to my ears and I have no doubt to it's hit potential.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
"Without the common people you're nothing"
Nos Sumus Una Familia
- TeddyB Not Logged In
- Graffiti Bandit Pioneer
- Posts: 2013
- Joined: 06 Feb 2009, 8:42pm
Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
No reason to be sorry, Marky. I was merely adjusting the official record.Marky Dread wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 10:09pmSorry if I mislead anyone here. I wrongly assumed it came direct from MJ.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:57pmFor the record, my copy didn’t come from MJ but from a friend of us both, who he had it run off for back in ‘82. So he’s got plausible deniability! Also, it’s not sequenced, though again the four “final” (not final) acetates are sequenced as above.
Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
I wonder how different (if at all), the band's legacy would be if Mick's version had come out. LC as a double, S! as a triple, then another double with RP. It would have been a bold move, and I wonder if the band would now be lauded as one of the more ambitious bands of all time. Not that LC and S! don't already help with that legacy.Marky Dread wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 10:09pmSorry if I mislead anyone here. I wrongly assumed it came direct from MJ.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:57pmFor the record, my copy didn’t come from MJ but from a friend of us both, who he had it run off for back in ‘82. So he’s got plausible deniability! Also, it’s not sequenced, though again the four “final” (not final) acetates are sequenced as above.
It's such a fascinating document. I love how it shows Micks vision of that time. Although the band chose the Glyn Johns route to cut down the length for a more commercial record. Micks RPfFB is a very commercial sounding record to my ears and I have no doubt to it's hit potential.
"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc
- Marky Dread
- Messiah of the Milk Bar
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- Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 11:26am
Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
That's pretty much as I see it Kory. But then you know look at B.A.D. and consider how groundbreaking that first album was and how loads of bands in it's wake were doing the rock/dance/samples crossover thing. I don't hear a great deal of respect going to Mick for that.Kory wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 11:18pmI wonder how different (if at all), the band's legacy would be if Mick's version had come out. LC as a double, S! as a triple, then another double with RP. It would have been a bold move, and I wonder if the band would now be lauded as one of the more ambitious bands of all time. Not that LC and S! don't already help with that legacy.Marky Dread wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 10:09pmSorry if I mislead anyone here. I wrongly assumed it came direct from MJ.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:57pmFor the record, my copy didn’t come from MJ but from a friend of us both, who he had it run off for back in ‘82. So he’s got plausible deniability! Also, it’s not sequenced, though again the four “final” (not final) acetates are sequenced as above.
It's such a fascinating document. I love how it shows Micks vision of that time. Although the band chose the Glyn Johns route to cut down the length for a more commercial record. Micks RPfFB is a very commercial sounding record to my ears and I have no doubt to it's hit potential.
The Clash in my opinion only really moved forward with their sound largely due to mick. Paul was mostly reggae, Joe was rockabilly/R&B and Mick was dance/technology. Remember Mick was known as rock 'n' roll Mick and then the band teased him and called him whack attack that is a big leap between the two. But Mick was much smarter than that and he had the vision to see where rock was heading. Never afraid of moving forward "now this sound is brave and wants to be free" and completely shedding that stupid punk rock straightjacket.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
"Without the common people you're nothing"
Nos Sumus Una Familia
Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
thats so right Marky, esp that last sentence. I was one of the fools screaming at Mick to play "Stay Free" at those first shows at The World and was totally disgusted when he played "1999".. it took me too long to realize how punk he/it all truly was. I love CR because it feels like every influence is unified rather than going from genre to genre, but Rat Patrol is clearly superior- bold n boundary pushing in the way only Clash can do. Also,maybe they would have gone on further if it had came out. I write all this with Death Is A Star pro'll being a favorite track, so take it or leave it.. :)Marky Dread wrote: ↑22 Nov 2017, 6:31amThat's pretty much as I see it Kory. But then you know look at B.A.D. and consider how groundbreaking that first album was and how loads of bands in it's wake were doing the rock/dance/samples crossover thing. I don't hear a great deal of respect going to Mick for that.Kory wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 11:18pmI wonder how different (if at all), the band's legacy would be if Mick's version had come out. LC as a double, S! as a triple, then another double with RP. It would have been a bold move, and I wonder if the band would now be lauded as one of the more ambitious bands of all time. Not that LC and S! don't already help with that legacy.Marky Dread wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 10:09pmSorry if I mislead anyone here. I wrongly assumed it came direct from MJ.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:57pmFor the record, my copy didn’t come from MJ but from a friend of us both, who he had it run off for back in ‘82. So he’s got plausible deniability! Also, it’s not sequenced, though again the four “final” (not final) acetates are sequenced as above.
It's such a fascinating document. I love how it shows Micks vision of that time. Although the band chose the Glyn Johns route to cut down the length for a more commercial record. Micks RPfFB is a very commercial sounding record to my ears and I have no doubt to it's hit potential.
The Clash in my opinion only really moved forward with their sound largely due to mick. Paul was mostly reggae, Joe was rockabilly/R&B and Mick was dance/technology. Remember Mick was known as rock 'n' roll Mick and then the band teased him and called him whack attack that is a big leap between the two. But Mick was much smarter than that and he had the vision to see where rock was heading. Never afraid of moving forward "now this sound is brave and wants to be free" and completely shedding that stupid punk rock straightjacket.
Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
Think there was a few of us guilty of thataza wrote: ↑22 Nov 2017, 12:18pmthats so right Marky, esp that last sentence. I was one of the fools screaming at Mick to play "Stay Free" at those first shows at The World and was totally disgusted when he played "1999".. it took me too long to realize how punk he/it all truly was. I love CR because it feels like every influence is unified rather than going from genre to genre, but Rat Patrol is clearly superior- bold n boundary pushing in the way only Clash can do. Also,maybe they would have gone on further if it had came out. I write all this with Death Is A Star pro'll being a favorite track, so take it or leave it.. :)Marky Dread wrote: ↑22 Nov 2017, 6:31amThat's pretty much as I see it Kory. But then you know look at B.A.D. and consider how groundbreaking that first album was and how loads of bands in it's wake were doing the rock/dance/samples crossover thing. I don't hear a great deal of respect going to Mick for that.Kory wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 11:18pmI wonder how different (if at all), the band's legacy would be if Mick's version had come out. LC as a double, S! as a triple, then another double with RP. It would have been a bold move, and I wonder if the band would now be lauded as one of the more ambitious bands of all time. Not that LC and S! don't already help with that legacy.Marky Dread wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 10:09pmSorry if I mislead anyone here. I wrongly assumed it came direct from MJ.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:57pmFor the record, my copy didn’t come from MJ but from a friend of us both, who he had it run off for back in ‘82. So he’s got plausible deniability! Also, it’s not sequenced, though again the four “final” (not final) acetates are sequenced as above.
It's such a fascinating document. I love how it shows Micks vision of that time. Although the band chose the Glyn Johns route to cut down the length for a more commercial record. Micks RPfFB is a very commercial sounding record to my ears and I have no doubt to it's hit potential.
The Clash in my opinion only really moved forward with their sound largely due to mick. Paul was mostly reggae, Joe was rockabilly/R&B and Mick was dance/technology. Remember Mick was known as rock 'n' roll Mick and then the band teased him and called him whack attack that is a big leap between the two. But Mick was much smarter than that and he had the vision to see where rock was heading. Never afraid of moving forward "now this sound is brave and wants to be free" and completely shedding that stupid punk rock straightjacket.
- WestwayKid
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Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
This would have made a fascinating album and looking at this track listing - seeing songs in different places - makes me rethink the whole flow of the LP.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:33pmWhatever the debate, this is the running order Mick had cut to acetates at Electric Lady for RPFFB. There is also a photo of the four sided sequence from Electric Lady that was posted here sometime back, maybe by C.K.
SIDE 1
Straight to Hell
Know Your Rights
Rock the Casbah
Red Angel Dragnet
SIDE 2
Should I Stay or Should I Go?
Ghetto Defendant
Sean Flynn
SIDE 3
Car Jamming
The Fulham Connection II
Atom Tan
First Night Back in London
SIDE 4
Inoculated City
Death is a Star
Cool Confusion
Idle in Kangaroo Court W1
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- 101Walterton
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Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
Mick grew up looking to America for new and exciting things, he never lost that interest.Marky Dread wrote: ↑22 Nov 2017, 6:31amThat's pretty much as I see it Kory. But then you know look at B.A.D. and consider how groundbreaking that first album was and how loads of bands in it's wake were doing the rock/dance/samples crossover thing. I don't hear a great deal of respect going to Mick for that.Kory wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 11:18pmI wonder how different (if at all), the band's legacy would be if Mick's version had come out. LC as a double, S! as a triple, then another double with RP. It would have been a bold move, and I wonder if the band would now be lauded as one of the more ambitious bands of all time. Not that LC and S! don't already help with that legacy.Marky Dread wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 10:09pmSorry if I mislead anyone here. I wrongly assumed it came direct from MJ.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:57pmFor the record, my copy didn’t come from MJ but from a friend of us both, who he had it run off for back in ‘82. So he’s got plausible deniability! Also, it’s not sequenced, though again the four “final” (not final) acetates are sequenced as above.
It's such a fascinating document. I love how it shows Micks vision of that time. Although the band chose the Glyn Johns route to cut down the length for a more commercial record. Micks RPfFB is a very commercial sounding record to my ears and I have no doubt to it's hit potential.
The Clash in my opinion only really moved forward with their sound largely due to mick. Paul was mostly reggae, Joe was rockabilly/R&B and Mick was dance/technology. Remember Mick was known as rock 'n' roll Mick and then the band teased him and called him whack attack that is a big leap between the two. But Mick was much smarter than that and he had the vision to see where rock was heading. Never afraid of moving forward "now this sound is brave and wants to be free" and completely shedding that stupid punk rock straightjacket.
Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
This guy was the first time I had seen that running order: http://albumsthatneverwere.blogspot.com ... bragg.html. It blew my mind...along with Mick's more atmospheric mixes, this running order maximizes the creepy factor. I turned off the lights, lit a j, and listened in a haze that very night. The album presented this way is very interesting statement and I want to live inside it.WestwayKid wrote: ↑22 Nov 2017, 2:27pmThis would have made a fascinating album and looking at this track listing - seeing songs in different places - makes me rethink the whole flow of the LP.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:33pmWhatever the debate, this is the running order Mick had cut to acetates at Electric Lady for RPFFB. There is also a photo of the four sided sequence from Electric Lady that was posted here sometime back, maybe by C.K.
SIDE 1
Straight to Hell
Know Your Rights
Rock the Casbah
Red Angel Dragnet
SIDE 2
Should I Stay or Should I Go?
Ghetto Defendant
Sean Flynn
SIDE 3
Car Jamming
The Fulham Connection II
Atom Tan
First Night Back in London
SIDE 4
Inoculated City
Death is a Star
Cool Confusion
Idle in Kangaroo Court W1
"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc
Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
I think this is my favorite part about it (and something that CK was a big pusher of). Everything before was like "here's a reggae tune, here's a rockabilly tune," but RP offered something truly unique. The genre that CK called "mongrel rock" and I call "narco funk" (coined by the guy from the link in the first post of this thread) could have been outstanding if followed and developed for another album or two.aza wrote: ↑22 Nov 2017, 12:18pmthats so right Marky, esp that last sentence. I was one of the fools screaming at Mick to play "Stay Free" at those first shows at The World and was totally disgusted when he played "1999".. it took me too long to realize how punk he/it all truly was. I love CR because it feels like every influence is unified rather than going from genre to genre, but Rat Patrol is clearly superior- bold n boundary pushing in the way only Clash can do. Also,maybe they would have gone on further if it had came out. I write all this with Death Is A Star pro'll being a favorite track, so take it or leave it.. :)Marky Dread wrote: ↑22 Nov 2017, 6:31amThat's pretty much as I see it Kory. But then you know look at B.A.D. and consider how groundbreaking that first album was and how loads of bands in it's wake were doing the rock/dance/samples crossover thing. I don't hear a great deal of respect going to Mick for that.Kory wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 11:18pmI wonder how different (if at all), the band's legacy would be if Mick's version had come out. LC as a double, S! as a triple, then another double with RP. It would have been a bold move, and I wonder if the band would now be lauded as one of the more ambitious bands of all time. Not that LC and S! don't already help with that legacy.Marky Dread wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 10:09pmSorry if I mislead anyone here. I wrongly assumed it came direct from MJ.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑21 Nov 2017, 9:57pmFor the record, my copy didn’t come from MJ but from a friend of us both, who he had it run off for back in ‘82. So he’s got plausible deniability! Also, it’s not sequenced, though again the four “final” (not final) acetates are sequenced as above.
It's such a fascinating document. I love how it shows Micks vision of that time. Although the band chose the Glyn Johns route to cut down the length for a more commercial record. Micks RPfFB is a very commercial sounding record to my ears and I have no doubt to it's hit potential.
The Clash in my opinion only really moved forward with their sound largely due to mick. Paul was mostly reggae, Joe was rockabilly/R&B and Mick was dance/technology. Remember Mick was known as rock 'n' roll Mick and then the band teased him and called him whack attack that is a big leap between the two. But Mick was much smarter than that and he had the vision to see where rock was heading. Never afraid of moving forward "now this sound is brave and wants to be free" and completely shedding that stupid punk rock straightjacket.
"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc
- TeddyB Not Logged In
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Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
Yes, but to be honest, C.K. was also disappointed in the sound of RPFFB. His idea of Mongrel Rock, exemplified by the Lyceum gigs of October 1981, was noisier and more aggressive sounding than the studio version.
Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
That's true, I forgot about his Car Jamming stance. I guess that's why I like the "narco funk" tag a little better, in that case.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑22 Nov 2017, 3:28pmYes, but to be honest, C.K. was also disappointed in the sound of RPFFB. His idea of Mongrel Rock, exemplified by the Lyceum gigs of October 1981, was noisier and more aggressive sounding than the studio version.
"Suck our Earth dick, Martians!" —Doc
- Marky Dread
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Re: Rat Patrol reconstruction
The fact that both you and CK coined terms to define the sounds speaks volumes to the ingenuity of the music.Kory wrote: ↑22 Nov 2017, 4:17pmThat's true, I forgot about his Car Jamming stance. I guess that's why I like the "narco funk" tag a little better, in that case.TeddyB Not Logged In wrote: ↑22 Nov 2017, 3:28pmYes, but to be honest, C.K. was also disappointed in the sound of RPFFB. His idea of Mongrel Rock, exemplified by the Lyceum gigs of October 1981, was noisier and more aggressive sounding than the studio version.
Forces have been looting
My humanity
Curfews have been curbing
The end of liberty
We're the flowers in the dustbin...
No fuchsias for you.
"Without the common people you're nothing"
Nos Sumus Una Familia