Which is why the sell-out argument is bullshit. They were never that single-minded that they could follow a coherent strategy properly. The crazy messiness of Sandinista! wasn't a dope-fueled indulgence (well, it was but …), it was the contradictory and pluralist essence of the group.
Clash single choices
- Dr. Medulla
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Re: Clash single choices
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
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Low Down Low
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Re: Clash single choices
For what its worth, this more or less corresponds with my own thesis on the commercial side of the band. I would also keep some space for the word integrity in there, not that it doesn't come without a raft of qualifications and caveats, but when you entangle all the acts of apparent self-sabotage, all the fuck ups and missed opportunities and whatever other crap went on, I do strongly believe there was a core element of integrity underpinning it all.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 11:40amWhich is why the sell-out argument is bullshit. They were never that single-minded that they could follow a coherent strategy properly. The crazy messiness of Sandinista! wasn't a dope-fueled indulgence (well, it was but …), it was the contradictory and pluralist essence of the group.
Re: Clash single choices
Seriously — how do you even describe songs like Atom Tan, RAD, GD or Sean Flynn? Or even First Night, Cool Confusion, Long Time Jerk, etc.
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Re: Clash single choices
Depending on how you apply the word, yeah. Sincerity is what I'd say. Given how cyncical and how unromantic most of us tend to be, the Clash end up seeming weirdos.Low Down Low wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 1:05pmFor what its worth, this more or less corresponds with my own thesis on the commercial side of the band. I would also keep some space for the word integrity in there, not that it doesn't come without a raft of qualifications and caveats, but when you entangle all the acts of apparent self-sabotage, all the fuck ups and missed opportunities and whatever other crap went on, I do strongly believe there was a core element of integrity underpinning it all.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 11:40amWhich is why the sell-out argument is bullshit. They were never that single-minded that they could follow a coherent strategy properly. The crazy messiness of Sandinista! wasn't a dope-fueled indulgence (well, it was but …), it was the contradictory and pluralist essence of the group.
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft
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Re: Clash single choices
Without the rap, and better production? Maybe?Jimmy Jazz wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 10:57amOverpowered by Funk is the obvious third choice from Combat Rock. All the kids love the rap!
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"But the gorilla thinks otherwise!"
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Re: Clash single choices
I also agree that if CR is a sellout album, they had no idea how. My biggest problem is that it’s meandering and strange without being as compelling as Sandinista.
”INDER LOCK THE THE KISS THREAD IVE REALISED IM A PRZE IDOOT” - Thomas Jefferson
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Low Down Low
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Re: Clash single choices
Sincerity might be the more apposite word alright. I find it compelling that Mick was generally the one portrayed as the more commercially minded, the one who wanted the hits and all the rock star trappings, and yet if he'd had his way, we'd have had the unwieldy and probably unsellable Rat Patrol over the accessible CR. The Clash finally made money on a record, virtually secured their pensions, and Mick was probably the one least happy about it.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 1:14pmDepending on how you apply the word, yeah. Sincerity is what I'd say. Given how cyncical and how unromantic most of us tend to be, the Clash end up seeming weirdos.Low Down Low wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 1:05pmFor what its worth, this more or less corresponds with my own thesis on the commercial side of the band. I would also keep some space for the word integrity in there, not that it doesn't come without a raft of qualifications and caveats, but when you entangle all the acts of apparent self-sabotage, all the fuck ups and missed opportunities and whatever other crap went on, I do strongly believe there was a core element of integrity underpinning it all.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 11:40amWhich is why the sell-out argument is bullshit. They were never that single-minded that they could follow a coherent strategy properly. The crazy messiness of Sandinista! wasn't a dope-fueled indulgence (well, it was but …), it was the contradictory and pluralist essence of the group.
- 101Walterton
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Re: Clash single choices
I disagree about STH.matedog wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:57amAgreed. I wouldn't release STH as a single for commercial purposes. If I had to pick a third single from CR...Car Jamming? I don't know, KYR is about as strident and monotonous as you can get, so that one is out. Other than that, Ghetto Defendant is the only other sort of traditional song structure. Other than the Gingsburg bits.Low Down Low wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:37amStraight to Hell is arguably Joe's greatest lyric and a top 10 Clash tune at the worst, but I never got commercial single vibe off it. SISOSIG is on all levels a far inferior song but a more viable commercial entity. Just my gut feeling on it.
Remember this was 1982 the charts were full of weird and wonderful stuff. Even DA Da Da got to #2!!!
Re: Clash single choices
But Da Da Da is much closer to Should I Stay Or Should I Go. In fact, they're more or less the same song.101Walterton wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 3:24pmI disagree about STH.matedog wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:57amAgreed. I wouldn't release STH as a single for commercial purposes. If I had to pick a third single from CR...Car Jamming? I don't know, KYR is about as strident and monotonous as you can get, so that one is out. Other than that, Ghetto Defendant is the only other sort of traditional song structure. Other than the Gingsburg bits.Low Down Low wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:37amStraight to Hell is arguably Joe's greatest lyric and a top 10 Clash tune at the worst, but I never got commercial single vibe off it. SISOSIG is on all levels a far inferior song but a more viable commercial entity. Just my gut feeling on it.
Remember this was 1982 the charts were full of weird and wonderful stuff. Even DA Da Da got to #2!!!
Who pfaffed the pfaff? Who got pfaffed tonight?
- Heston
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Re: Clash single choices
Correct, that one took me by surprise back in the day.Olaf wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 5:19pmBut Da Da Da is much closer to Should I Stay Or Should I Go. In fact, they're more or less the same song.101Walterton wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 3:24pmI disagree about STH.matedog wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:57amAgreed. I wouldn't release STH as a single for commercial purposes. If I had to pick a third single from CR...Car Jamming? I don't know, KYR is about as strident and monotonous as you can get, so that one is out. Other than that, Ghetto Defendant is the only other sort of traditional song structure. Other than the Gingsburg bits.Low Down Low wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:37amStraight to Hell is arguably Joe's greatest lyric and a top 10 Clash tune at the worst, but I never got commercial single vibe off it. SISOSIG is on all levels a far inferior song but a more viable commercial entity. Just my gut feeling on it.
Remember this was 1982 the charts were full of weird and wonderful stuff. Even DA Da Da got to #2!!!
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board
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Re: Clash single choices
I never made that connection until this post!!!Heston wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:21pmCorrect, that one took me by surprise back in the day.Olaf wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 5:19pmBut Da Da Da is much closer to Should I Stay Or Should I Go. In fact, they're more or less the same song.101Walterton wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 3:24pmI disagree about STH.matedog wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:57amAgreed. I wouldn't release STH as a single for commercial purposes. If I had to pick a third single from CR...Car Jamming? I don't know, KYR is about as strident and monotonous as you can get, so that one is out. Other than that, Ghetto Defendant is the only other sort of traditional song structure. Other than the Gingsburg bits.Low Down Low wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:37amStraight to Hell is arguably Joe's greatest lyric and a top 10 Clash tune at the worst, but I never got commercial single vibe off it. SISOSIG is on all levels a far inferior song but a more viable commercial entity. Just my gut feeling on it.
Remember this was 1982 the charts were full of weird and wonderful stuff. Even DA Da Da got to #2!!!
- Heston
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Re: Clash single choices
To clarify, by "back in the day" I meant when Olaf mentioned it years ago on here. I never made the connection at the time.101Walterton wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:45pmI never made that connection until this post!!!Heston wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:21pmCorrect, that one took me by surprise back in the day.Olaf wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 5:19pmBut Da Da Da is much closer to Should I Stay Or Should I Go. In fact, they're more or less the same song.101Walterton wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 3:24pmI disagree about STH.matedog wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:57am
Agreed. I wouldn't release STH as a single for commercial purposes. If I had to pick a third single from CR...Car Jamming? I don't know, KYR is about as strident and monotonous as you can get, so that one is out. Other than that, Ghetto Defendant is the only other sort of traditional song structure. Other than the Gingsburg bits.
Remember this was 1982 the charts were full of weird and wonderful stuff. Even DA Da Da got to #2!!!
There's a tiny, tiny hopeful part of me that says you guys are running a Kaufmanesque long con on the board
- 101Walterton
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Re: Clash single choices
Coincidence or not?Heston wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:49pmTo clarify, by "back in the day" I meant when Olaf mentioned it years ago on here. I never made the connection at the time.101Walterton wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:45pmI never made that connection until this post!!!Heston wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:21pmCorrect, that one took me by surprise back in the day.Olaf wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 5:19pmBut Da Da Da is much closer to Should I Stay Or Should I Go. In fact, they're more or less the same song.101Walterton wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 3:24pm
I disagree about STH.
Remember this was 1982 the charts were full of weird and wonderful stuff. Even DA Da Da got to #2!!!
Trio released Da Da Da as a single March 1982 and SISOSIG released June 1982.
But both songs were written and recorded in 1981 but Trio included it on their s/t album released 1981 yet CR not released until 1982?
So unless Trio heard it live????
Re: Clash single choices
I don't think it was on the original s/t album (maybe added later). It's just a weird coincidence I guess.101Walterton wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 10:06pmCoincidence or not?Heston wrote: ↑21 Aug 2018, 9:49pmTo clarify, by "back in the day" I meant when Olaf mentioned it years ago on here. I never made the connection at the time.
Trio released Da Da Da as a single March 1982 and SISOSIG released June 1982.
But both songs were written and recorded in 1981 but Trio included it on their s/t album released 1981 yet CR not released until 1982?
So unless Trio heard it live????
Who pfaffed the pfaff? Who got pfaffed tonight?
- Dr. Medulla
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Re: Clash single choices
"Da Da Da" was one of those rare moments when the charts welcomed something truly unusual (e.g., "O Superman" or "Pump Up the Volume") and you can't figure out how the fuck that happened, that the gatekeepers fucked up somehow to let the unconventional and genuinely captivating thru.
"Grab some wood, bub.'" - Richard Nixon, Checkers Speech, abandoned early draft