Oh, McCain...

[Still216]

McCain speech = nap time

I was politely listening until he said the evangelical buzzphrase "culture of life". Then I zoned out - that's the dealbreaker.

Someone tell the 18 year olds yelling out during the quiet moments of McCain's speech that they are doing nothing to contribute and everything to alienate undecided voters. This isn't protest, it's jerky college kids looking for their minute of celebrity. If they want their ten thousand hits on YouTube, there's more creative ways to do it. If the Young Republicans outclass the Young Democrats on any front, it's that the Young Republicans didn't pull this nonsense during Obama's speech.

[IkarisOne]

Poor McCain can't even be bothered to pretend that any of this means anything anymore. The decisions are all made by the corporate think tanks and NGOs and all the politicians do these days is try to sell them. I'm sitting this election out. Perhaps all future ones as well. I remember it clearly- I was sitting in my old office on Election Night 2000 and it suddenly struck me- elections are just pep rallies to decide which side of the artificially-constructed cultural divide will put the pre-decided policies into place. Every cycle they trot out the same wedge issues, the same bromides, and nothing is ever done about any of them in the off years. Even the hardcore Christofascist types can't seem to pretend that anything will ever be done about abortion anymore.

Tired, sad. Well to the post-democracy era.

[Dr. Medulla]

The chief difference between the two parties (and the distinction generally holds true in Canada) is that the rate of retreat from any notion of democracy and social justice is much greater when the right wing is in power. The best we can do when a slightly more centrist party is in charge is a holding pattern. The main thing that gives me hope is the possibility that Strauss & Howe's generational theory is accurate, and that once the Boomers no longer dominate politics will be less phony values and morality-driven and more problem-oriented.

[IkarisOne]

The chief difference between the two parties (and the distinction generally holds true in Canada) is that the rate of retreat from any notion of democracy and social justice is much greater when the right wing is in power. The best we can do when a slightly more centrist party is in charge is a holding pattern. The main thing that gives me hope is the possibility that Strauss & Howe's generational theory is accurate, and that once the Boomers no longer dominate politics will be less phony values and morality-driven and more problem-oriented.

I wish I believed that, I really do, but I remember the Clinton years. All Bush did was finish what Clinton started. The irony is that the Republican base (the Southeast and Midwest, particularly) are the ones who are getting the most hammered by high gas and food prices, the real estate slump, the casualties of war, outsourcing, etc etc etc. I've often wondered if they put a party in power when they're getting ready to put the screws to their constituency. Sort of a consolation prize. Wait until after the election when fuel prices shoot back up again. Or what happens with hurricane season.

[Flex]

Putting aside the death of democracy for a moment:

Holy shit, Jeffrey Toobin just ripped apart McCain's speech. Wow.

[Flex]

The chief difference between the two parties (and the distinction generally holds true in Canada) is that the rate of retreat from any notion of democracy and social justice is much greater when the right wing is in power. The best we can do when a slightly more centrist party is in charge is a holding pattern. The main thing that gives me hope is the possibility that Strauss & Howe's generational theory is accurate, and that once the Boomers no longer dominate politics will be less phony values and morality-driven and more problem-oriented.

I wish I believed that, I really do, but I remember the Clinton years. All Bush did was finish what Clinton started. The irony is that the Republican base (the Southeast and Midwest, particularly) are the ones who are getting the most hammered by high gas and food prices, the real estate slump, the casualties of war, outsourcing, etc etc etc. I've often wondered if they put a party in power when they're getting ready to put the screws to their constituency. Sort of a consolation prize. Wait until after the election when fuel prices shoot back up again. Or what happens with hurricane season.

Bush and Clinton are the epitome of the boomer generation. Obama is the first candidate of an actual different generation.

Addendum: Not to refute either of your general points, but I think that you two might be on slightly different lines of discussion

[Dr. Medulla]

The chief difference between the two parties (and the distinction generally holds true in Canada) is that the rate of retreat from any notion of democracy and social justice is much greater when the right wing is in power. The best we can do when a slightly more centrist party is in charge is a holding pattern. The main thing that gives me hope is the possibility that Strauss & Howe's generational theory is accurate, and that once the Boomers no longer dominate politics will be less phony values and morality-driven and more problem-oriented.

I wish I believed that, I really do, but I remember the Clinton years. All Bush did was finish what Clinton started.

But that's my point—both Clinton and Bush are Boomers and play the values, us vs. them, good vs. evil game well, but it's all bullshit and about dividing people. Should Obama win, he'd be the first Gen X president, and if Strauss & Howe's theory continue to hold water, he'd be more oriented to solve problems rather be driven by ideology (Truman and Ike were the last presidents to come from the same generational type as Xers). It'll take a few more electoral cycles, I would imagine, for Xers to dominate Congress. Maybe it won't matter—indeed, Palin is an Xer, and seems cut from the Boomer cloth— because too many authoritarian forces are too entrenched for it to make a difference, but that's the hope I'm working on.

[IkarisOne]

The chief difference between the two parties (and the distinction generally holds true in Canada) is that the rate of retreat from any notion of democracy and social justice is much greater when the right wing is in power. The best we can do when a slightly more centrist party is in charge is a holding pattern. The main thing that gives me hope is the possibility that Strauss & Howe's generational theory is accurate, and that once the Boomers no longer dominate politics will be less phony values and morality-driven and more problem-oriented.

I wish I believed that, I really do, but I remember the Clinton years. All Bush did was finish what Clinton started.

But that's my point—both Clinton and Bush are Boomers and play the values, us vs. them, good vs. evil game well, but it's all bullshit and about dividing people. Should Obama win, he'd be the first Gen X president, and if Strauss & Howe's theory continue to hold water, he'd be more oriented to solve problems rather be driven by ideology (Truman and Ike were the last presidents to come from the same generational type as Xers). It'll take a few more electoral cycles, I would imagine, for Xers to dominate Congress. Maybe it won't matter—indeed, Palin is an Xer, and seems cut from the Boomer cloth— because too many authoritarian forces are too entrenched for it to make a difference, but that's the hope I'm working on.

Palin is just a narcissist. She'll leave politics and become a talk show host. Mark my words.

[Dr. Medulla]

Palin is just a narcissist. She'll leave politics and become a talk show host. Mark my words.

I've thought the exact same thing. She'll get a show on Fox News, along with a syndicated radio show, to keep up her profile before running in 2012. Pretty much Pat Buchanan's strategy in the 80s—play the pundit game before running.

[eumaas]

Poor McCain can't even be bothered to pretend that any of this means anything anymore. The decisions are all made by the corporate think tanks and NGOs and all the politicians do these days is try to sell them. I'm sitting this election out. Perhaps all future ones as well. I remember it clearly- I was sitting in my old office on Election Night 2000 and it suddenly struck me- elections are just pep rallies to decide which side of the artificially-constructed cultural divide will put the pre-decided policies into place. Every cycle they trot out the same wedge issues, the same bromides, and nothing is ever done about any of them in the off years. Even the hardcore Christofascist types can't seem to pretend that anything will ever be done about abortion anymore.

Tired, sad. Well to the post-democracy era.

Shit, I've been making those arguments on here for years--good to see you falling in with my lot. Sorry to say, it's a terribly cynical worldview to hold but it's the closest to the truth. Electoral politics is simply a circus whereby the illusion of legitimacy is obtained.

I wish I believed that, I really do, but I remember the Clinton years. All Bush did was finish what Clinton started. The irony is that the Republican base (the Southeast and Midwest, particularly) are the ones who are getting the most hammered by high gas and food prices, the real estate slump, the casualties of war, outsourcing, etc etc etc. I've often wondered if they put a party in power when they're getting ready to put the screws to their constituency. Sort of a consolation prize. Wait until after the election when fuel prices shoot back up again. Or what happens with hurricane season.

Bingo. Monthly Review covered this... Human Rights Imperialism. Dress up your foreign adventures in human rights language. Bush sold the Afghanistan and Iraq wars as wars for liberation and human rights. Same fucking language used under Clinton. The policies of NAFTA have been merely analogized and extended. Globally, i.e. in their capacity as the fingers of an imperial corporate hand, the Dems and Republicans aren't much different, whether in economics or in war. People hate America no matter the president's totem animal. No fucking wonder.

[Mimi]

McCain speech = nap time

I was listening to it as I was getting ready for bed. I fell asleep while brushing my teeth.

[Dr. Medulla]

Real Americans love McCain.

[classof77]

THREE electoral votes she brings to the table. Appeals to the lunatic fringe of home-schooled, earth is 6000 years old, gun-toting, NRA for life, anti-personal freedom while masquerading as Absolute Personal Freedom Champions types......If the Dems just completely ignore her what happens? THREE electoral votes (oh, and probably twenty or so counties in the west and southeast).

I'm also sick of the electoral process but--at this point--the alternative is mob rule ( and with the sophistication of modern media and the complete lack of sophistication among the masses --due mostly to their manipulation by the ruling elite--Dems, Republicans whatever) or progressing deeper into the corporate fascism that is the ascending model-- just don't really see either as a viable alternative. At least with an electoral system we kind of have a say and we kind of have a chance to change things.

[Wolter]

[IkarisOne]

THREE electoral votes she brings to the table. Appeals to the lunatic fringe of home-schooled, earth is 6000 years old, gun-toting, NRA for life, anti-personal freedom while masquerading as Absolute Personal Freedom Champions types......If the Dems just completely ignore her what happens? THREE electoral votes (oh, and probably twenty or so counties in the west and southeast).

I'm also sick of the electoral process but--at this point--the alternative is mob rule ( and with the sophistication of modern media and the complete lack of sophistication among the masses --due mostly to their manipulation by the ruling elite--Dems, Republicans whatever) or progressing deeper into the corporate fascism that is the ascending model-- just don't really see either as a viable alternative. At least with an electoral system we kind of have a say and we kind of have a chance to change things.

I don't see it that way. I don't know how anyone can still think voting really matters in the Diebold Age. It's irritating to live in a blue state when the Republicans are in charge (and I'm speaking as an old-line Yankee conservative/libertarian who hates the GOP like poison {I think the Dems are a bunch of cowering schoolmarms, but the quasi-fascist mood of the country keeps them from getting carried away with themselves}) but the next few years are going to be devastating to a lot of Red states with their long commutes, high A/C bills, underhanded mortgages and easily exported blue collar jobs. If you live in a Red state and they put McCain in- move. It means they're going to suck you dry. Alaska's been ripe for the pickings- only those despised do-gooder environmentalists are saving it from becoming a toxic wastedump with emptied out seabeds. Palin might be the cover they need for an end-run.