Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 01 Apr 2023, 7:26pm
Mrs Hoy very very generally resembles Boebert. Now if only I could get her to roleplay….
If Music Could Talk
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Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
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Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 02 Apr 2023, 1:06am
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 02 Apr 2023, 9:46am
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 02 Apr 2023, 9:54am
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 02 Apr 2023, 9:56am
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 02 Apr 2023, 3:56pm
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/north-ca ... 84198dc5d6
On the one hand, yeah, participation trophies are stupid. Coffee’s for closers. But something to legislate? Back in the day, that’s the kind of shit where Republicans would mock Democrats for stupid instrusion.
On the one hand, yeah, participation trophies are stupid. Coffee’s for closers. But something to legislate? Back in the day, that’s the kind of shit where Republicans would mock Democrats for stupid instrusion.
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 05 Apr 2023, 6:56am
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 05 Apr 2023, 8:20am
I really don’t feel strongly about the matter but I think participation trophies are fine. Nothing wrong with rewarding a kid for putting themselves out there. Also, and most importantly, the participation trophy is never as good as the real one, so it’s not like kids don’t know the winner is rewarded more greatly.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑02 Apr 2023, 3:56pmhttps://www.huffpost.com/entry/north-ca ... 84198dc5d6
On the one hand, yeah, participation trophies are stupid. Coffee’s for closers. But something to legislate? Back in the day, that’s the kind of shit where Republicans would mock Democrats for stupid instrusion.
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 05 Apr 2023, 8:30am
I'm of the view that the reward of participation is internal, not some trinket. In the same way, I was raised where my allowance was not tied to any household responsibilities (e.g., mowing the lawn, taking out the garbage). Being part of the family and contributing to the household were one in the same. I couldn't opt out and just forfeit my allowance that week. My allowance was for being part of the family and so were my chores. It's about making household responsibilities something that transcends the transactional. So participating in sports or anything like that shouldn't be bound up in the expectation of getting a materialn prize at the end. If you win, sure, let's mark that achievement. But just participating shouldn't come attached to getting a reward. You do it because you do it.matedog wrote: ↑05 Apr 2023, 8:20amI really don’t feel strongly about the matter but I think participation trophies are fine. Nothing wrong with rewarding a kid for putting themselves out there. Also, and most importantly, the participation trophy is never as good as the real one, so it’s not like kids don’t know the winner is rewarded more greatly.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑02 Apr 2023, 3:56pmhttps://www.huffpost.com/entry/north-ca ... 84198dc5d6
On the one hand, yeah, participation trophies are stupid. Coffee’s for closers. But something to legislate? Back in the day, that’s the kind of shit where Republicans would mock Democrats for stupid instrusion.
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 05 Apr 2023, 8:54am
Hello,Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑05 Apr 2023, 8:30amI'm of the view that the reward of participation is internal, not some trinket. In the same way, I was raised where my allowance was not tied to any household responsibilities (e.g., mowing the lawn, taking out the garbage). Being part of the family and contributing to the household were one in the same. I couldn't opt out and just forfeit my allowance that week. My allowance was for being part of the family and so were my chores. It's about making household responsibilities something that transcends the transactional. So participating in sports or anything like that shouldn't be bound up in the expectation of getting a materialn prize at the end. If you win, sure, let's mark that achievement. But just participating shouldn't come attached to getting a reward. You do it because you do it.matedog wrote: ↑05 Apr 2023, 8:20amI really don’t feel strongly about the matter but I think participation trophies are fine. Nothing wrong with rewarding a kid for putting themselves out there. Also, and most importantly, the participation trophy is never as good as the real one, so it’s not like kids don’t know the winner is rewarded more greatly.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑02 Apr 2023, 3:56pmhttps://www.huffpost.com/entry/north-ca ... 84198dc5d6
On the one hand, yeah, participation trophies are stupid. Coffee’s for closers. But something to legislate? Back in the day, that’s the kind of shit where Republicans would mock Democrats for stupid instrusion.
This can get into a long discussion of developing extrinsic versus an intrinsic motivation. Parents should attempt to foster an intrinsic motivation towards sports and arts. I see this (and have seen this) on a vast number of layers and could go on for hours.
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 05 Apr 2023, 9:22am
That's one of the key tenets of punk that I try to get across to students. Why do you do the things you do? Because you feel a need to do them. Why perform? Because it's something you need to do. Why do you create a zine? Personal need. It's not about money—being rewarded—but satisfying that internal desire to create and do. In Marxist terms, it's unalienated labour. Stuff that brings joy and satisfaction in the doing alone, not compensation or legal requirement/coercion. It's so valuable to adjust your thinking to divorce yourself from the stuff you do for money from the stuff you do for joy, and don't contaminate the latter with the former. Which is why some punks argue that you shouldn't turn your art into your career. Don't give up your day job because it means turning your art into your job, and that ends up ruining the joy you get from art.gkbill wrote: ↑05 Apr 2023, 8:54amHello,Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑05 Apr 2023, 8:30amI'm of the view that the reward of participation is internal, not some trinket. In the same way, I was raised where my allowance was not tied to any household responsibilities (e.g., mowing the lawn, taking out the garbage). Being part of the family and contributing to the household were one in the same. I couldn't opt out and just forfeit my allowance that week. My allowance was for being part of the family and so were my chores. It's about making household responsibilities something that transcends the transactional. So participating in sports or anything like that shouldn't be bound up in the expectation of getting a materialn prize at the end. If you win, sure, let's mark that achievement. But just participating shouldn't come attached to getting a reward. You do it because you do it.matedog wrote: ↑05 Apr 2023, 8:20amI really don’t feel strongly about the matter but I think participation trophies are fine. Nothing wrong with rewarding a kid for putting themselves out there. Also, and most importantly, the participation trophy is never as good as the real one, so it’s not like kids don’t know the winner is rewarded more greatly.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑02 Apr 2023, 3:56pmhttps://www.huffpost.com/entry/north-ca ... 84198dc5d6
On the one hand, yeah, participation trophies are stupid. Coffee’s for closers. But something to legislate? Back in the day, that’s the kind of shit where Republicans would mock Democrats for stupid instrusion.
This can get into a long discussion of developing extrinsic versus an intrinsic motivation. Parents should attempt to foster an intrinsic motivation towards sports and arts. I see this (and have seen this) on a vast number of layers and could go on for hours.
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 05 Apr 2023, 9:30am
Anecdotally, pretty much every time I try to do something I love or have a passion for or whatever as as my like, regular-ass job, it always ends up pretty psychologically ruinous. Ive come to counsel pretty much the opposite of the old "do work that you love and you'll never work a day in your life" bullshit. I'd go: make sure you can tolerate what you do and make sure you have time for your passions outside of work. Capitalism will always ruin what you love, especially when your day to day survival is attached to it.
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 05 Apr 2023, 9:45am
Precisely. Tho, that said, I will say that what I do now is an exception to that rule. I flat-out love what I do and would literally do it for free, except for the grading. I regard my pay as for grading alone. But talking about the dumb shit that I talk about, fuck, yeah, it’s fun and rewarding in ways so much beyond money. I don’t need to keep researching and writing new lectures. That’s for me and I’m just happy to pass it on to others. But, yeah, every other job I’ve had was work in the most pejorative sense and any pleasure I derived was in spite of it all.Flex wrote: ↑05 Apr 2023, 9:30amAnecdotally, pretty much every time I try to do something I love or have a passion for or whatever as as my like, regular-ass job, it always ends up pretty psychologically ruinous. Ive come to counsel pretty much the opposite of the old "do work that you love and you'll never work a day in your life" bullshit. I'd go: make sure you can tolerate what you do and make sure you have time for your passions outside of work. Capitalism will always ruin what you love, especially when your day to day survival is attached to it.
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 05 Apr 2023, 10:02am
Yeah, there's definitely exceptions so it's just - like all such advice - a rule of thumb, and some of it has to do with what your passions are and whatnot, but man oh man have I seen (and experienced) people's loves and passions used to ruthlessly exploit their (our) labor and then toss 'em to the curb when they're used up.Dr. Medulla wrote: ↑05 Apr 2023, 9:45amPrecisely. Tho, that said, I will say that what I do now is an exception to that rule. I flat-out love what I do and would literally do it for free, except for the grading. I regard my pay as for grading alone. But talking about the dumb shit that I talk about, fuck, yeah, it’s fun and rewarding in ways so much beyond money. I don’t need to keep researching and writing new lectures. That’s for me and I’m just happy to pass it on to others. But, yeah, every other job I’ve had was work in the most pejorative sense and any pleasure I derived was in spite of it all.Flex wrote: ↑05 Apr 2023, 9:30amAnecdotally, pretty much every time I try to do something I love or have a passion for or whatever as as my like, regular-ass job, it always ends up pretty psychologically ruinous. Ive come to counsel pretty much the opposite of the old "do work that you love and you'll never work a day in your life" bullshit. I'd go: make sure you can tolerate what you do and make sure you have time for your passions outside of work. Capitalism will always ruin what you love, especially when your day to day survival is attached to it.
On participation trophies, I side with the "stoke personal drive/sense of commitment to the community outside external validation" but I'm also sympathetic to the sense of need for them insofar as I think they're basically a response to the fact we live in a culture that's almost entirely driven by external reward (money, fame, trophies). Hard to tell your kid to lift their head up high for trying their best when everything around them extolls the virtues of "bringing home a trophy" and "winning isn't everything, it's the only thing" mindset and so forth (mind, aside from anything else, I don't think participation trophies are very effective at addressing any of this anyways - as Hoy says, outside of maybe super young ages, a kid still KNOWS how they did - but I'm just sympathetic to the impulse). It all seems like a pretty natural response for how hyper-individualistic (and focused on socially rewarding that individualism) we are/have become as a society.
Re: Parenting (...or My Precious Snowflake is Better Than Yours)
Posted: 05 Apr 2023, 10:59am
Academia is quite brutal in that regard. Universities know that professors have a passion for their specialties—especially those starting out—and squeeze that fruit to get every last drop of juice. Those who work in design (like Kory) also get abused horribly for their love of creativity.Flex wrote: ↑05 Apr 2023, 10:02amYeah, there's definitely exceptions so it's just - like all such advice - a rule of thumb, and some of it has to do with what your passions are and whatnot, but man oh man have I seen (and experienced) people's loves and passions used to ruthlessly exploit their (our) labor and then toss 'em to the curb when they're used up.
Stuff like that is a moment when I’m glad I don’t have a kid because head and heart would be in such a terrible struggle.On participation trophies, I side with the "stoke personal drive/sense of commitment to the community outside external validation" but I'm also sympathetic to the sense of need for them insofar as I think they're basically a response to the fact we live in a culture that's almost entirely driven by external reward (money, fame, trophies). Hard to tell your kid to lift their head up high for trying their best when everything around them extolls the virtues of "bringing home a trophy" and "winning isn't everything, it's the only thing" mindset and so forth (mind, aside from anything else, I don't think participation trophies are very effective at addressing any of this anyways - as Hoy says, outside of maybe super young ages, a kid still KNOWS how they did - but I'm just sympathetic to the impulse). It all seems like a pretty natural response for how hyper-individualistic (and focused on socially rewarding that individualism) we are/have become as a society.