Interesting Take on the Beatles

General music discussion.
Post Reply
Flex
User avatar
Mechano-Man of the Future
Posts: 25036
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:50pm
Location: The Information Superhighway!
Contact:

Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by Flex » 20 Jun 2008, 3:19pm

I don't particularly agree with this article's opinions, although I see an element of truth:

http://www.scaruffi.com/vol1/beatles.html

Thought some folks here might find it, uh, interesting at least.
"I live inside my own heart, Matt Damon." - Prince

Sous les pavés, la plage.

Pex Lives!

Dr. Medulla
User avatar
Atheistic Epileptic
Posts: 71182
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
Location: Nerdo Crombezia
Contact:

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by Dr. Medulla » 20 Jun 2008, 3:40pm

What a load of crap. That the writer relies on such dubious foundations as "real music" or "real musicians" reveals the inherent snobbery. Likewise the assertion that contemporary musicians didn't respect the Beatles as musicians. Okay, name them. Who were all these "real musicians" who thought the Beatles had no talent? Additionally, there's an implicit dismissal of the general public, that anything popular with large groups of people is immediately questionable.
Walrus birth doesn't make good breakfast conversation!

Flex
User avatar
Mechano-Man of the Future
Posts: 25036
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:50pm
Location: The Information Superhighway!
Contact:

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by Flex » 20 Jun 2008, 3:46pm

Dr. Medulla wrote:What a load of crap. That the writer relies on such dubious foundations as "real music" or "real musicians" reveals the inherent snobbery. Likewise the assertion that contemporary musicians didn't respect the Beatles as musicians. Okay, name them. Who were all these "real musicians" who thought the Beatles had no talent? Additionally, there's an implicit dismissal of the general public, that anything popular with large groups of people is immediately questionable.
Most of it is crap, I think the point that is more or less correct is that the Beatles weren't really forerunners in Rock n Roll innovation (from a structural standpoint). That they were a more conservative group musically than many like to admit rings true with me. Regardless, it's a weird thing to be critical of with the group, since those tendencies were what made it possible for most people to become aware of experimentation in rock n roll (cuz most people sure as shit weren't listening to early Pink Floyd and the like).
"I live inside my own heart, Matt Damon." - Prince

Sous les pavés, la plage.

Pex Lives!

Rat Patrol
User avatar
Unknown Immortal
Posts: 14581
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 9:23pm
Location: A flat burning junkheap for twenty square miles

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by Rat Patrol » 20 Jun 2008, 3:54pm

Real music is derivative of Pavement anyway.

:shifty:
Image

JoseUnidos
User avatar
Graffiti Bandit Pioneer
Posts: 1052
Joined: 16 Jun 2008, 8:52am

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by JoseUnidos » 20 Jun 2008, 3:55pm

Flex wrote:Regardless, it's a weird thing to be critical of with the group, since those tendencies were what made it possible for most people to become aware of experimentation in rock n roll (cuz most people sure as shit weren't listening to early Pink Floyd and the like).
Interesting footnote that Pink Floyd were recording The Piper at the Gates of Dawn in the studio adjacent to the Beatles, who were recording Sgt. Peppers at the same time.

Dr. Medulla
User avatar
Atheistic Epileptic
Posts: 71182
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
Location: Nerdo Crombezia
Contact:

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by Dr. Medulla » 20 Jun 2008, 3:58pm

Flex wrote:
Dr. Medulla wrote:What a load of crap. That the writer relies on such dubious foundations as "real music" or "real musicians" reveals the inherent snobbery. Likewise the assertion that contemporary musicians didn't respect the Beatles as musicians. Okay, name them. Who were all these "real musicians" who thought the Beatles had no talent? Additionally, there's an implicit dismissal of the general public, that anything popular with large groups of people is immediately questionable.
Most of it is crap, I think the point that is more or less correct is that the Beatles weren't really forerunners in Rock n Roll innovation (from a structural standpoint). That they were a more conservative group musically than many like to admit rings true with me. Regardless, it's a weird thing to be critical of with the group, since those tendencies were what made it possible for most people to become aware of experimentation in rock n roll (cuz most people sure as shit weren't listening to early Pink Floyd and the like).
I can't really speak to stuff like structural innovation because I'm not a musician. But the author is seriously misreading—or selectively reading—history to dismiss their musical impact, how they advanced notions of how rock songs were to be written and presented, to suggest that they were somehow neutering something that was pure. Horseshit. They took it in a different direction, that's all. Obviously the direction blew a lot of people away. Some picked up on what the Beatles were doing and took that in a different direction. And so on. The band may have had very conservative goals—sell a lot of albums, tour the world, etc etc—but they went about it by pushing forward a medium that was still not fully accepted by the general public. Listening to early Beatles albums, I don't hear a bastardized form of rock n roll, I hear rock n roll. That the writer wants to argue some perversion of eden and conning of the public doesn't make it true.
Walrus birth doesn't make good breakfast conversation!

CorwoodRep
User avatar
Unknown Immortal
Posts: 6311
Joined: 17 Jun 2008, 2:39am

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by CorwoodRep » 20 Jun 2008, 4:10pm

I liked that article a great deal, but only because I just can't fuckin' stand the Beatles.
"Put down the meth, boy." - TeddyB, 2013.

MadModWorld
User avatar
Trashy Britpop Kid
Posts: 717
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:51pm
Location: Somewhere between Heaven & Woolworths...
Contact:

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by MadModWorld » 20 Jun 2008, 4:24pm

DrugProwlingWolf wrote:I liked that article a great deal, but only because I just can't fuckin' stand the Beatles.
Why not?
Some people never go crazy. What truly horrible lives they must lead...
Image

Flex
User avatar
Mechano-Man of the Future
Posts: 25036
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:50pm
Location: The Information Superhighway!
Contact:

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by Flex » 20 Jun 2008, 4:29pm

Dr. Medulla wrote:I can't really speak to stuff like structural innovation because I'm not a musician. But the author is seriously misreading—or selectively reading—history to dismiss their musical impact, how they advanced notions of how rock songs were to be written and presented, to suggest that they were somehow neutering something that was pure. Horseshit. They took it in a different direction, that's all. Obviously the direction blew a lot of people away. Some picked up on what the Beatles were doing and took that in a different direction. And so on. The band may have had very conservative goals—sell a lot of albums, tour the world, etc etc—but they went about it by pushing forward a medium that was still not fully accepted by the general public. Listening to early Beatles albums, I don't hear a bastardized form of rock n roll, I hear rock n roll. That the writer wants to argue some perversion of eden and conning of the public doesn't make it true.
Well, I've gone as far as I'd like discussing an article neither of us believe. Mostly, I was hoping to illicit some sort of "without The Beatles there would be no beauty in rock" type response. That is an actual thing I have heard said.
"I live inside my own heart, Matt Damon." - Prince

Sous les pavés, la plage.

Pex Lives!

Dr. Medulla
User avatar
Atheistic Epileptic
Posts: 71182
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:00pm
Location: Nerdo Crombezia
Contact:

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by Dr. Medulla » 20 Jun 2008, 4:32pm

Flex wrote: I was hoping to illicit some sort of "without The Beatles there would be no beauty in rock" type response.
I would deserve one of my feet washing ashore in B.C. if I ever said something like that.
Walrus birth doesn't make good breakfast conversation!

Flex
User avatar
Mechano-Man of the Future
Posts: 25036
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 2:50pm
Location: The Information Superhighway!
Contact:

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by Flex » 20 Jun 2008, 4:33pm

Dr. Medulla wrote:
Flex wrote: I was hoping to illicit some sort of "without The Beatles there would be no beauty in rock" type response.
I would deserve one of my feet washing ashore in B.C. if I ever said something like that.
Well, not elicit from you obviously...

but from Inder. :shifty:
"I live inside my own heart, Matt Damon." - Prince

Sous les pavés, la plage.

Pex Lives!

Howard Beale
Dirty Punk
Posts: 85
Joined: 16 Jun 2008, 1:51am

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by Howard Beale » 20 Jun 2008, 5:03pm

Their strength was perhaps being the epitome of mediocrity: never a flash of genius, never a revolutionary thought, never a step away from what was standard, accepting innovations only after they had been accepted by the establishment. And maybe it was that chronic mediocrity that made their fortune: whereas other bands tried to surpass their audiences, to keep two steps ahead of the myopia of their fans, traveling the hard and rocky road, the Beatles took their fans by the hand and walked them along a straight path devoid of curves and slopes.
Image

Wolter
User avatar
Half Foghorn Leghorn, Half Woody Allen
Posts: 49246
Joined: 15 Jun 2008, 7:59pm
Location: ¡HOLIDAY RO-O-O-O-O-O-O-O-O-OAD!
Contact:

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by Wolter » 20 Jun 2008, 5:06pm

Howard Beale wrote:
Their strength was perhaps being the epitome of mediocrity: never a flash of genius, never a revolutionary thought, never a step away from what was standard, accepting innovations only after they had been accepted by the establishment. And maybe it was that chronic mediocrity that made their fortune: whereas other bands tried to surpass their audiences, to keep two steps ahead of the myopia of their fans, traveling the hard and rocky road, the Beatles took their fans by the hand and walked them along a straight path devoid of curves and slopes.
Image
So, once again, the internet is a haven for idiots who say provocative things with no basis in fact.

Next thing you know, he'll say that Waking Up was the best Clash solo album.
"There's something more honest, he believed, about traditional methods of mass starvation, labour camps, and machine gunning millions to death. Stalin was a vinyl guy who sneered at Truman converting everything to compact disc." - Thomas Jefferson

"But the gorilla thinks otherwise!"

Inder
User avatar
corecore vanguard
Posts: 7985
Joined: 14 Jun 2008, 3:28pm

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by Inder » 20 Jun 2008, 5:16pm

This article: :rolleyes:

tepista
User avatar
Foul-Mouthed Werewolf
Posts: 31914
Joined: 16 Jun 2008, 11:25am
Location: Livin on a fault line, Waiting on the big one

Re: Interesting Take on the Beatles

Post by tepista » 20 Jun 2008, 5:28pm

Howard Beale wrote:
..............................to keep two steps ahead of the myopia of their fans, traveling the hard and rocky road, the Beatles took their fans by the hand and walked them along a straight path devoid of curves and slopes.
Image
The road was long and winding, not hard and rocky. Rocky was the racoon.
We reach the parts other combos cannot reach
We beach the beachheads other armies cannot beach
We speak the tongues other mouths cannot speak

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 6 guests