Punk … for credit

[Marky Dread]

Thought: Can anyone recommend any novels or short stories that they would consider punk? I have a few ideas here, too, but always up for others.

Not a short story but you should read this.

Is that fiction? I'm thinking of fiction that can somehow be thought of as demonstrating a punk sensibility (however that might be defined).

No not fiction.

[Low Down Low]

Can think of only a handful of novels that have dealt thematically with punk, the best probably Human Punk by John King. As for punk sensibility, kind of struggling a bit too. Irvine Welsh perhaps or Iain Banks? Wondering did punk leave that much of a mark at all, on the mainstream anyway? Something like ballard, as recently mentioned here, might fit the bill but more as an influencer of punk than being influenced by it. Interesting question.

[Marky Dread]

So try this one on for size.

[Marky Dread]

Ha! looks like Low Down Low beat me to the punch.

[Marky Dread]

Well if you want a book about punk that you consider fiction. Then I suggest you read a book about Wire.

[Low Down Low]

Ha! looks like Low Down Low beat me to the punch.

Theres a first time for everything

[Dr. Medulla]

Well if you want a book about punk that you consider fiction. Then I suggest you read a book about Wire.

I'm taking a fairly wide view of punk for this course and accepting post-punk, too, so nyeh, thppt, double thppt.

[Dr. Medulla]

Can think of only a handful of novels that have dealt thematically with punk, the best probably Human Punk by John King. As for punk sensibility, kind of struggling a bit too. Irvine Welsh perhaps or Iain Banks? Wondering did punk leave that much of a mark at all, on the mainstream anyway? Something like ballard, as recently mentioned here, might fit the bill but more as an influencer of punk than being influenced by it. Interesting question.

The King novel looks very promising for a sweeping consideration, based on the synopsis I read. Maybe even the kind of thing to start a course with. Thanks, LDL and Marky!

I thought of Welsh, too, and will probably do some skimming. I have this on interlibrary loan to see if it has promise.

[Marky Dread]

Well if you want a book about punk that you consider fiction. Then I suggest you read a book about Wire.

I'm taking a fairly wide view of punk for this course and accepting post-punk, too, so nyeh, thppt, double thppt.

12XU

[revbob]

Im always fascinated by the ugly, reactionary side of punk - your Skrewdrivers and what not, but even more acceptable but still somewhat reactionary elements of the hardcore and oi scenes. The tension of the ideals of so much of the scene that can also spawn this ugly underbelly is fascinating to me. And may have some resonance in our current landscape...

That's definitely going to form part of it because I've long asked how we are so confident that the "left" version of punk is its true spirit while the fascist side is heretical? Why isn't it the other way around? Or why are the Nazis heretical? Punk has always attracted and bred some nasty fuckers and we should better appreciate that something there. There is a collection of essays called White Riot: Punk Rock and the Politics of Race that I'll be drawing from on this point.

I think the roots of punk are certainly more left than right but probably predominantly apolitical at least in a formal sense.

As for another person to try and get a snippet from I would suggest Wayne Kramer. Gives some background on the beginnings of mixing aggressive music with politics.

[Dr. Medulla]

Im always fascinated by the ugly, reactionary side of punk - your Skrewdrivers and what not, but even more acceptable but still somewhat reactionary elements of the hardcore and oi scenes. The tension of the ideals of so much of the scene that can also spawn this ugly underbelly is fascinating to me. And may have some resonance in our current landscape...

That's definitely going to form part of it because I've long asked how we are so confident that the "left" version of punk is its true spirit while the fascist side is heretical? Why isn't it the other way around? Or why are the Nazis heretical? Punk has always attracted and bred some nasty fuckers and we should better appreciate that something there. There is a collection of essays called White Riot: Punk Rock and the Politics of Race that I'll be drawing from on this point.

I think the roots of punk are certainly more left than right but probably predominantly apolitical at least in a formal sense.

The fascist leanings in punk are in its impulses to action for its own sake—the liberation in violence, even if it's just moshing—and often a suspicion of intellectuals as authoritarian in some way. The punk figures we admire here are the ones who promote critical thinking, but some take critical thinking to mean blanket rejection of other views, which leads down an ugly path. You're right, I think, in calling punk predominantly apolitical, but that's another way of saying it can then tip between anarchist, socialist, or fascist.

As for another person to try and get a snippet from I would suggest Wayne Kramer. Gives some background on the beginnings of mixing aggressive music with politics.

That's an interesting choice, and not one I'd have thought of!

[Olaf]

Rainald Goetz was certainly influenced by Punk at the time.

[Dr. Medulla]

Rainald Goetz was certainly influenced by Punk at the time.

Never heard of him, but he seems a rather … engaged fellow.

[Olaf]

Rainald Goetz was certainly influenced by Punk at the time.

Never heard of him, but he seems a rather … engaged fellow.

Bloody right.

[Marky Dread]

Rainald Goetz was certainly influenced by Punk at the time.

I hope he eventually gave Keith Levene his hair back