Albums, how long is too long

General music discussion.
threecoffins
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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by threecoffins » 19 Jun 2008, 2:17pm

almo wrote:Personally, I think albums should be no longer than 45 minutes and no shorter than 30. It helps if I like all the songs, but that's rarely the case these days. As you first put it, there's just too much damn filler more often than not. Rarely these days do I hear a release that's most/all solid tracks.
I think albums are going extinct now. Nobody listens to, or records for the benefit of, full albums any more (generally speaking). Most albums now have a really top-heavy sequencing, because they know a lot of people aren't gonna wait around for that gem at the tail end of Side B! I think its all heading into the realm of internet singles, which in a way is a completion of a cycle, bringing us back to the first singles-based days of rock 'n' roll.

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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by AdamRamone » 19 Jun 2008, 2:31pm

threecoffins wrote:
almo wrote:Personally, I think albums should be no longer than 45 minutes and no shorter than 30. It helps if I like all the songs, but that's rarely the case these days. As you first put it, there's just too much damn filler more often than not. Rarely these days do I hear a release that's most/all solid tracks.
I think albums are going extinct now. Nobody listens to, or records for the benefit of, full albums any more (generally speaking). Most albums now have a really top-heavy sequencing, because they know a lot of people aren't gonna wait around for that gem at the tail end of Side B! I think its all heading into the realm of internet singles, which in a way is a completion of a cycle, bringing us back to the first singles-based days of rock 'n' roll.

good observation, I agree.

its a shame that most people dont care about albums anymore.
big business it dont like you

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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by almo » 19 Jun 2008, 2:37pm

AdamRamone wrote:
threecoffins wrote:
almo wrote:Personally, I think albums should be no longer than 45 minutes and no shorter than 30. It helps if I like all the songs, but that's rarely the case these days. As you first put it, there's just too much damn filler more often than not. Rarely these days do I hear a release that's most/all solid tracks.
I think albums are going extinct now. Nobody listens to, or records for the benefit of, full albums any more (generally speaking). Most albums now have a really top-heavy sequencing, because they know a lot of people aren't gonna wait around for that gem at the tail end of Side B! I think its all heading into the realm of internet singles, which in a way is a completion of a cycle, bringing us back to the first singles-based days of rock 'n' roll.

good observation, I agree.

its a shame that most people dont care about albums anymore.
Seconded. Even though there are some bands that still care about putting forth a collection of 10+ solid tunes, they really are a dying breed. :(

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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by daredevil » 19 Jun 2008, 2:49pm

I think when cd's were introduced to consumers, record labels wanted to provide more music than what
was usually on an lp. This was probably because the price was almost twice as much, and they wanted
to give the impression you were getting your money's worth.
But most times there just wasn't enough quality material to fill out 60 plus minutes.

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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by Dirty Harry » 19 Jun 2008, 3:04pm

Even Paul Weller's bringing out double albums these days.

Not that i'm complaining mind you.
Somebody was trying to tell me that CDs are better than vinyl because they don't have any surface noise. I said, "Listen, mate, "life" has surface noise."


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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by MadModWorld » 19 Jun 2008, 4:05pm

Including spoken-word poems about God, spoken by Ian Brown's guitarist.

Not that I don't absolutely love that 'song'
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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by Heston » 19 Jun 2008, 6:41pm

Dirty Harry wrote:Even Paul Weller's bringing out double albums these days.
Is that why he hasn't got time to get his hair sorted out?
So what does Marconi playing the mamba mean? "Marconi" is referring to the radio itself. It plays a deadly snake. The snake - the mamba - is slithering from the speakers. Ready to kill greedy corporations. Ready to free the world of all that is evil, and to leave behind only the youthful idealism encompassed by the tenets of rock and roll.

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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by deedar » 19 Jun 2008, 6:47pm

i blame the cd format before they came onto the market you had no real idea how long the record was the first time you played it, but now as soon as you put in the cd you see how long it lasts, why the hell do we need that information, i mean back in vinyl days it didn`t matter, i could play the ramones its alive and not think of how much time i`d been listening , nor say a shorter lp like the dickies debut or the misfits walk among us, which i am now told thanks to cd is only 23 minutes and blah blah seconds.

so put some duct tape across that cd clock and i promise you`ll enjoy the music again

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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by dd_ » 20 Jun 2008, 7:45am

The ideal length for me in the "old days" was just under 45 minutes. That way you could fill a 90 minute cassette with one LP on each side with barely any white space.

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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by bazarboy75 » 20 Jun 2008, 9:31am

Artists shouldn't care about what the lenght of their songs are....
In a ideal musical world

What upset me a bit in this discussion is that it came from someone who listen to music.
I mean i can understand easily why radio or producer looking for a short and effectives songs (MONEY !!!) but by someone who REALLY listen to music it's a bit despairing......

By the way, it's a it hard to explain but, i learnt that at the vinyl age for some technical reason (to hard for me to describe in english clearly) the last song of the sides (near the center) were "always" the weakest.
Because of bass frequency stuff the sound was less good so the artist very often choose to put weakest ones here.
Funny isn't it ?
Some new INDIEGROUND tracks

https://soundcloud.com/indieground

Some old tracks
http://soundcloud.com/bazarboy

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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by Flex » 20 Jun 2008, 11:02am

bazarboy75 wrote:Artists shouldn't care about what the lenght of their songs are....
In a ideal musical world
I tend to agree, although if artists have some sense of length it might help them trim unnecessary elements of a song instead of giving into self-indulgence.
What upset me a bit in this discussion is that it came from someone who listen to music.
I mean i can understand easily why radio or producer looking for a short and effectives songs (MONEY !!!) but by someone who REALLY listen to music it's a bit despairing......
I think it sort of depends on what music and bands we're talking about. I imagine most people here had bands like (the mentioned upthread) Rancid in mind for this question. In other words, bands which tended to fit into a mold of the 3 minute rock song. If you have 80 minutes worth of 3 minute songs, it's tough to keep the level of quality high throughout the album. I think that for more experimental rock and non-rock music, the single-lp format might be a limitation that has finally been overcome. I have some electronica groups that pretty much fill up their cds and it sounds good (well, good relative for the genre. some here might dispute whether that in itself is "good" or not), but bands like that really build albums in a different way than a rock group.

I also don't necessarily agree that short songs are only about money. Sometimes it's trying to strip away all the excess to get at the core of an idea/emotion/whatever. Also, come on, it's not like Dead Kennedys' "Short Songs" could have ever been written with the idea of making money off of a short and effective song in mind.
By the way, it's a it hard to explain but, i learnt that at the vinyl age for some technical reason (to hard for me to describe in english clearly) the last song of the sides (near the center) were "always" the weakest.
Because of bass frequency stuff the sound was less good so the artist very often choose to put weakest ones here.
Funny isn't it ?
This is interesting. Could someone elaborate on this (I don't want to put you on the spot b-boy)?
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Sous les pavés, la plage.

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bazarboy75
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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by bazarboy75 » 20 Jun 2008, 11:15am

No offense buddy
I don't have anymore time now to make some research on the internet but i'll try to find some stuff next week

Have a nice week end everybodies
Some new INDIEGROUND tracks

https://soundcloud.com/indieground

Some old tracks
http://soundcloud.com/bazarboy

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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by Flex » 20 Jun 2008, 11:34am

bazarboy75 wrote:No offense buddy
I don't have anymore time now to make some research on the internet but i'll try to find some stuff next week
Oh, no offense taken. I just meant if anyone else had any info they could elaborate since you said you were having some trouble with your English.
Last edited by Flex on 20 Jun 2008, 11:37am, edited 1 time in total.
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Sous les pavés, la plage.

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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by Heston » 20 Jun 2008, 11:34am

Flex wrote:This is interesting. Could someone elaborate on this (I don't want to put you on the spot b-boy)?
From Wiki:
A further limitation of the record is that with a constant rotational speed, the quality of the sound may differ across the width of the record because the inner groove modulations are more compressed than those of the outer tracks. The result is that inner tracks have distortion that can be noticeable at higher recording levels.
So what does Marconi playing the mamba mean? "Marconi" is referring to the radio itself. It plays a deadly snake. The snake - the mamba - is slithering from the speakers. Ready to kill greedy corporations. Ready to free the world of all that is evil, and to leave behind only the youthful idealism encompassed by the tenets of rock and roll.

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Re: Albums, how long is too long

Post by eumaas » 20 Jun 2008, 11:36am

Flex wrote:you said you were having some trouble with the English.
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"The only thing that really occurs to me that I can say on this is to point out how fascinating it is that the Hassan-i-Sabbah archetype keeps turning up over and over again ... He disappears up into the mountains and is never seen again. Believe me, he'll never be seen again. He'll live forever because of that."

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